Zattaxu
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:11 pm

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Thu Nov 14, 2019 9:04 am

JejuSoul wrote:-
I believe Kia recognized the fact that many batteries were failing and would soon need replacement years ago.
It helps understand why Kia stopped selling EVs in the American market and focused almost entirely on Norway.
Norway - the one place where climate and driving conditions mean a substantial number of battery packs will survive.
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There have been reports of failing battery packs also in Norway. As some owners has had their cars 5 years (first cars were delivered autumn 2014) many owners has reached 100.000 km (appx 60.000 miles) or more. I don't know the percentage which have claimed replacement, (Norw. warranty: 70 % capacity after 150.000 km/7 years), but my impression from Norw. EV forums/Facebook groups is that a lot of owners of the cars which have passed 100.000 km are experiencing degradation problems. Some have had their battery packs replaced after waiting up to 6 monts on a new pack.

My car (registered November 2014) started showing signs of degradtion at appx 80.000 - 90.000 km and according to the Soul EV Spy app, SOH is now at 76,1 %, down from 82,1 % just a few months ago. It seems degradation is happening faster now than ealier.

Oinq
Posts: 70
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:34 am
Contact: Website

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:10 am

But now, the winter is coming, I suppose you will only find it out in the spring... Please keep us current; I'm very curious about how it will be the next few months with your battery.

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Soul EV 2016

JejuSoul
Posts: 1443
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:47 am
Location: Jeju
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Re: Battery Ageing Model

Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:27 am

Zattaxu wrote:...There have been reports of failing battery packs also in Norway. As some owners has had their cars 5 years (first cars were delivered autumn 2014) many owners has reached 100.000 km (appx 60.000 miles) or more. I don't know the percentage which have claimed replacement, (Norw. warranty: 70 % capacity after 150.000 km/7 years), but my impression from Norw. EV forums/Facebook groups is that a lot of owners of the cars which have passed 100.000 km are experiencing degradation problems. Some have had their battery packs replaced after waiting up to 6 months on a new pack...

Thanks for posting Zattaxu. This is the first battery replacement story from Norway I have seen.
I have just read your post on elbilforum.no - Mistet kapasitet på fremdriftsbatteri - erfaringer?

I still think that as a percentage the failure rate in Norway will be much lower than elsewhere. At present almost 42% of all Soul EVs ever produced are in Norway. Clearly some of those cars are now failing. But I assume many are not.
I base this assumption on the N issan L eaf, which has a high failure rate in the USA and a low failure rate in Norway.
Am hoping the Soul EV doesn't turn out to be worse than the L eaf.
If it is, then it means we have been looking in the wrong direction 'high temperatures' as the cause of most battery failures. Instead it may be 'battery stress' caused by long and fast journeys that are the primary cause.

I have been tracking the number of Soul EVs in Norway for quite a few years now because of the bogus news articles that came out about Kia doing an 'emission scam' and reselling cars from Germany into Norway.

Here is a chart that shows the total number of Kia Soul EVs in Norway broken down into those directly imported, and those 'sold' in another European country and then shipped into Norway a few days later. Here shown as imports.

Image

The 'emission scam' articles can now easily be debunked if you know that now Norway is included in the EU emissions zone. The simple reason for importing cars is that dealers made money doing it.
The codes for using Torque Pro can be found by clicking the link in the website icon under my user name on the left.

Zattaxu
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:11 pm

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Fri Nov 15, 2019 7:48 am

JejuSoul wrote:I still think that as a percentage the failure rate in Norway will be much lower than elsewhere. At present almost 42% of all Soul EVs ever produced are in Norway. Clearly some of those cars are now failing. But I assume many are not.
I base this assumption on the N issan L eaf, which has a high failure rate in the USA and a low failure rate in Norway.
Am hoping the Soul EV doesn't turn out to be worse than the L eaf.
If it is, then it means we have been looking in the wrong direction 'high temperatures' as the cause of most battery failures. Instead it may be 'battery stress' caused by long and fast journeys that are the primary cause.


So far I have read about appx 10 stories of failing battery packs in Norway (but remember that not everyone that experience battery failure write a post about it...). I think you are right in assuming that temperature is the single factor affwcting the battery pack, but it seems like long and fast journies are relevant as well, even in colder climate.

Omar
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 1:27 am

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:47 pm

Also here in Jordan it is clear!. The Soul EV's here are mostly imported from the US, few are from South Korea. Most of the ones that are standing for sale now, specially 2015 & 2016 models, have degraded batteries. They have a range similar to mine (around 82 miles GOM reading at 100%) or less!.
My car battery's SOH has rebounded to 65.4%, it was 64.5% a month ago.
The local Kia does not accept the warranty claims, as they do not sell electric cars in the region. However, there are several shops that fix degraded batteries or replace them. You can see many types of fixes!

1. Replacing the bad cells. I checked with one shop in order to replace 4 bad performing cells in my car, the cost will be 400$ for the cells and labor!. But Kia Soul cells are somewhat rare. They are normally dismantled from a wrecked car, or a good performing cells out of replaced batteries.
2. Installing a Nissan Leaf battery into the Kia Soul, knowing that Nissan Leaf is very common here, its batteries and cells are easily available in the local market, and they are cheaper. This fix costs little higher than 2,000$
3. Some cars get an assembled battery, composed of a certain number of cells of other car batteries, you can see some Kia Souls with 38 kWh batteries !!, most likely these cells are either Bolt EV cells or Nissan Leaf cells! This might cost more than 3,500$

Some mechanics are in fact electrical engineers, they even install a cooling system and connect it to the car BMS!

Oinq
Posts: 70
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:34 am
Contact: Website

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:00 am

Omar wrote:2. Installing a Nissan Leaf battery into the Kia Soul, knowing that Nissan Leaf is very common here, its batteries and cells are easily available in the local market, and they are cheaper. This fix costs little higher than 2,000$
3. Some cars get an assembled battery, composed of a certain number of cells of other car batteries, you can see some Kia Souls with 38 kWh batteries !!, most likely these cells are either Bolt EV cells or Nissan Leaf cells! This might cost more than 3,500$

Some mechanics are in fact electrical engineers, they even install a cooling system and connect it to the car BMS!



Impressive! ;)

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Soul EV 2016

Zattaxu
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:11 pm

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:15 am

Oinq wrote:But now, the winter is coming, I suppose you will only find it out in the spring... Please keep us current; I'm very curious about how it will be the next few months with your battery.


I have read some more posts on the Norwegian facebook forum for Kia Soul EV owners complaining about battery degradation and/or owners that have had their batteries replaced. One of the owners claim that his 27 kWh battery was replaced by a 30 kWh battery. According to him the Kia dealer called him after he had picked up the car, saying that he had to come back for a software update (for the GOM to work properly).

JejuSoul
Posts: 1443
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:47 am
Location: Jeju
Contact: Website

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:24 am

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Zattaxu wrote:One of the owners claim that his 27 kWh battery was replaced by a 30 kWh battery. According to him the Kia dealer called him after he had picked up the car, saying that he had to come back for a software update (for the GOM to work properly).
Interesting find. Thanks for posting. There is a thread discussing the replacement batteries here - 2016 Soul EV+ Battery Replacement - Re-manufactured?
We have no proof that anyone has actually received an upgraded battery, despite lots of anecdotes. Kia is not saying anything
I'm still waiting for my battery to be replaced. Am hoping it's true.

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Saw this comment on the facebook forum
Ian Finlay wrote: My SOH started to deteriorate around 166,000 km when it "dropped of a cliff", dropping from the mid 80% range to 60% or so almost over night.

The warranty limit is 160,000km. To see a sudden cliff in the deterioration just after warranty expires must be really annoying.
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oldpueblo
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:32 pm

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:06 am

I just purchased a 2016 Kia Soul EV with 43k miles, and it had the battery replaced by Kia just before I bought it (I called the Kia Dealership it was serviced at on the CarFax to verify it). I'm not fully up to speed on everything regarding the battery, but I can run Soul EV Spy and report back anything if that helps anyone.

Omar
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 1:27 am

Re: Battery Ageing Model

Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:43 pm

Updating the status of my battery, now SOH has dropped to 62%, with the temperature drop in December its range is down to 115 Km. (It was like 145 km last winter). While my daily commute is sometimes 78 km while other times 98 km, So I decided to replace 4 - 5 cells, I called one famous mechanic here, it will cost me 400$.
He will use the cells from a used car battery. We agreed that I will check the performance of the cells within 1 month after the replacement. He will do it during my work shift, hopefully.

But I do not know really how much improvement I would get!.

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